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Avengers Feelings Dump
I have these feelings about Natasha and her fear of the Hulk, and about Bruce and Tony's conversation about the big green guy. Maybe they're feelings about Bruce/the other guy in general. No one that I've talked to about it sees as much depth as I do to this stuff, so here's the rant.
It's odd for me because so many people look at the scene with Tony and Bruce and go 'oh, Tony being a dick' or 'why did he do that?' or just 'ha ha, Hulk baiting'. I honestly think Tony was being dead serious through most of the scene.
We need to remember that Tony had a time when he nearly put Iron Man in a closet and made it something seperate from himself. He decided that he couldn't do that in the end and he nearly paid a terrible price for that in Iron Man 2. But he's gotten comfortable with it now. He knows how to deal with the risks of being high profile, the risks of being a danger to yourself and others, and he's decided that it's worth it. That with control, the benefits outweigh the risks.
That is what he's trying to tell Bruce. That if he let himself get used to it. If he practiced both as himself and as the other guy, then he might actually be able to help take care of things that matter to him. That the benefits might also outweigh the risks for him too.
Ok, so, that's the Tony feelings related to the Hulk. Then we move onto Natasha. From the very first conversation on the phone, it's clear that Banner and therefore the Hulk are things that really really disturb her. Disturb a woman who can be tied to a chair with three armed men around her and feel perfectly confident. People I've talked to have pointed out that Hulk really is a power house, that he's much stronger than any of them. I don't think that's all it is.
Natasha has layers upon layers of self control, she's an excellent actress and she always has a plan. We see this in her initial 'interrogation' and again in her interaction with Loki and again in her interactions with Clint. She is confident and controlled and on top of her game. All the time. Consider then that the very nature of the Hulk is completely anathema to that. Natasha layers on all that control because in her life she has been at the bottom of the filthiest pits of humanity, she knows what rage and desperation are. If she really started fighting and spying as young as she says, then there are more stains on her heart than we can even imagine... and she knows rightly to fear losing control and drowning in those emotions. And I think that if there's a deep-seated fear somewhere in her hindbrain, it's got to do with losing control and being crushed by it. She doesn't fear the hulk as much as an enemy as as a symbol. The Hulk is all that rage and pure unadulterated fury given nightmarish form... if /she/ could hulk out, maybe she doesn't think she'd ever stop.
Made a joke about the Stark Spangled Banner pairing after the movie this time. J totally shut down. IT WAS A JOKE. The most slash opposed person we know mentioned it to me, which is the only reason I said it... I thought she'd laugh. But no. Right. As if I could ever forget how very very unwelcome any mention of slash is.
Which brings me to the rest of the evening, where we finished season 2 of Merlin and started Season 3. So the end of Season 2 I am aching with my desire for Arthur and Merlin to be... together? A team. Trusting one another. And it never happens of course. Then on we go into Season 3. And I have this problem. The one where I ship the chemistry between Uther and Morgana (blame "Defenders of the Realm" for that) except that she's evil and lying, so not that. And then I ship Morgana/Morgause like burning. Also Morgause/Sendred. Morgause/winning I guess. She looks so gorgeous in armor... and I don't even like blondes most of the time.
I can discuss exactly none of these feelings with J. Because slash and fandom are evil. Because... I don't even know why. I genuinely am not sure how you go about enjoying a show if you're not involved in the fandom for it, if you're not reading subtext underlying it. Maybe I'm weird...
It's odd for me because so many people look at the scene with Tony and Bruce and go 'oh, Tony being a dick' or 'why did he do that?' or just 'ha ha, Hulk baiting'. I honestly think Tony was being dead serious through most of the scene.
We need to remember that Tony had a time when he nearly put Iron Man in a closet and made it something seperate from himself. He decided that he couldn't do that in the end and he nearly paid a terrible price for that in Iron Man 2. But he's gotten comfortable with it now. He knows how to deal with the risks of being high profile, the risks of being a danger to yourself and others, and he's decided that it's worth it. That with control, the benefits outweigh the risks.
That is what he's trying to tell Bruce. That if he let himself get used to it. If he practiced both as himself and as the other guy, then he might actually be able to help take care of things that matter to him. That the benefits might also outweigh the risks for him too.
Ok, so, that's the Tony feelings related to the Hulk. Then we move onto Natasha. From the very first conversation on the phone, it's clear that Banner and therefore the Hulk are things that really really disturb her. Disturb a woman who can be tied to a chair with three armed men around her and feel perfectly confident. People I've talked to have pointed out that Hulk really is a power house, that he's much stronger than any of them. I don't think that's all it is.
Natasha has layers upon layers of self control, she's an excellent actress and she always has a plan. We see this in her initial 'interrogation' and again in her interaction with Loki and again in her interactions with Clint. She is confident and controlled and on top of her game. All the time. Consider then that the very nature of the Hulk is completely anathema to that. Natasha layers on all that control because in her life she has been at the bottom of the filthiest pits of humanity, she knows what rage and desperation are. If she really started fighting and spying as young as she says, then there are more stains on her heart than we can even imagine... and she knows rightly to fear losing control and drowning in those emotions. And I think that if there's a deep-seated fear somewhere in her hindbrain, it's got to do with losing control and being crushed by it. She doesn't fear the hulk as much as an enemy as as a symbol. The Hulk is all that rage and pure unadulterated fury given nightmarish form... if /she/ could hulk out, maybe she doesn't think she'd ever stop.
Made a joke about the Stark Spangled Banner pairing after the movie this time. J totally shut down. IT WAS A JOKE. The most slash opposed person we know mentioned it to me, which is the only reason I said it... I thought she'd laugh. But no. Right. As if I could ever forget how very very unwelcome any mention of slash is.
Which brings me to the rest of the evening, where we finished season 2 of Merlin and started Season 3. So the end of Season 2 I am aching with my desire for Arthur and Merlin to be... together? A team. Trusting one another. And it never happens of course. Then on we go into Season 3. And I have this problem. The one where I ship the chemistry between Uther and Morgana (blame "Defenders of the Realm" for that) except that she's evil and lying, so not that. And then I ship Morgana/Morgause like burning. Also Morgause/Sendred. Morgause/winning I guess. She looks so gorgeous in armor... and I don't even like blondes most of the time.
I can discuss exactly none of these feelings with J. Because slash and fandom are evil. Because... I don't even know why. I genuinely am not sure how you go about enjoying a show if you're not involved in the fandom for it, if you're not reading subtext underlying it. Maybe I'm weird...